Ayla Ruby
The second season of Star Trek: Strange New Worlds was full of big science fiction swings and the kinds of episodes that honor the legacy of Trek shows that have boldly gone before it. Subspace Rhapsody, the ninth episode of the season, delivered something entirely different and thoroughly delightful. Directed by Dermott Downs and written by Dana Horgan and Bill Wolkoff, it’s the first full-on musical episode of the franchise. We talked to Kay Hanley and Tom Polce, the composers of the episode and wildly successful musicians in their own right (also helming Letters to Cleo), about bringing it to life.
Polce is known for his music and Hanley, her lyrics, and for Subspace Rhapsody, Polce described it as a “complete collaboration.” The two talked about how the project evolved from a few songs to a full-on musical. They talked about how they essentially had five weeks to write the songs and worked together with the episode’s writers, Henry Alonso Myers and Akiva Goldsman, to have the music reflect where things were going narratively. Polce and Hanley talked about working with each cast member to find their musical strengths and how some surprised them with their skill. And if you’re a Spock fan, you’ll want to read on to find out about how their Eureka moment writing Spock’s breakup song, I’m the X.
What was especially interesting about the conversation was how the two described having a fearlessness with the music. Writing songs for the characters in the service of the story on Strange New Worlds allowed them the freedom to explore feelings too personal for them to write about in their own music. Read on for the full conversation, but make sure you watch the episode first – and maybe watch that Klingon K-pop video twice.
Ayla Ruby: So we’re chatting everything Subspace Rhapsody with Strange New Worlds, and I would really love to hear how you guys got onto this episode. What was the conversation that led you to writing the musical episode of Strange New Worlds? The music for the musical episode?
Kay Hanley: Tom, take it away.
Tom Polce: Well, so it initially started with a conversation with the showrunners, sort of about, they were on a fact finding mission. They came to me because I am a composer and I’ve worked on lots of shows. I’ve worked on musical shows like Crazy Ex Girlfriend, and I’ve done musical things with shows like Jane the Virgin. So they just sort of said, “Hey, what does this look like if we want to do a musical? How much time does it take?” All of the sort of logistics. As it became apparent, they actually wanted to do a full on episode musical. We had lots and lots of conversations, and we got to know each other. Then at some point, they got to know my work, and we were certainly getting along as people. They asked, “Hey, would you like to, do you want to write these songs?” And I said, immediately I was just like, “Yes, absolutely. I want to write these songs.” And then the Zoom call ended, and then the cold sweats ensued, realizing, “Oh my God, I’ve got to write a musical-“
Kay Hanley: “What have I done?”
Tom Polce: “… in five weeks, done.” And it’s for Star Trek. What is that exactly? “Oh my gosh, I need some help.” So immediately I reached out to my sister, Kay. You go.
Kay Hanley: And I was like, well, first of all, during the earlier stages, he was… Well, actually, I won’t even get into all the earlier stages. I had known about this already because Tom was-
Tom Polce: Because I suggested her to do it before they asked me to do it. I was like, “Hey, do you want to do this?” And then it sort of just sort of went in limbo.
Kay Hanley: But he recommended me and my team because I write music for television. Specifically, I write songs for television. And so Tom had initially asked if I would be interested, could he pitch me for this? And I was like, “Oh my God, yes.” And then the next thing you know, he was like, “Do this.” And I was like, “Excuse me. What? The whole thing?” Because originally, he was going out to a bunch of teams so that a bunch of people could write the thing, because it’s such a huge such job. And when he ever told me that he was just going to take it on and would I be his lyricist, I was like, “Hell to the yes.” So we just, Tom and I have been writing for 30 years together. We’ve known each other since we were kids, since we were kids writing songs. So there was just like, we just dove in and just had at it.
Tom Polce: Yeah.
Ayla Ruby: Now, Tom, you mentioned five weeks to write all of the songs.
Tom Polce: Nine songs. Well, so the cold sweats began at five weeks, six songs, which turned into five weeks, nine songs. And just so we give Kay all the credit she deserves. Initially it was, “I’m going to need some help with the lyrics on this thing.” But the reality is we got together, and it was all of it. It was just all of it. It was a complete collab. I was more on the musical side, and she was more on the lyrics side. And it was really a lovely thing.
Kay Hanley: It was very much like family writing. It was a very big happy… Also sometimes volatile.
Tom Polce: I got the text to prove it.
Ayla Ruby: It works.
Tom Polce: Yeah.
Ayla Ruby: Now, was there a Star Trek learning curve, or had you guys been franchise fans before, or?
Tom Polce: So yes, Original Series fan, grew up with it, grew up with it, obviously on reruns, so I was very familiar with it. I mean, there’s not a whole lot of those episodes. So by the time I was 18, I had seen them all several times, and then college happened, and I think that was the Picard years, and I was sort of into that. And then it was just really a casual fan. And I think it’s a similar situation with Kay, whereas the original series, we grew up with those reruns, and then casual fans. By the time it got to us, thank goodness, the world, we understood that world in its original iteration. But yes, there was a learning curve. And yes, we took it super seriously because we knew several of these songs. While some of them lyrically and thematically relate to very general things.
There are some songs, and well, they all relate to general things, but some of the songs require very specific verbiage that you can’t mess around with. So yes, we did our homework and thank goodness we were partnered with Bill and Dana, the writers of the episode. So they would hit us with sort of like, if you can just imagine a grocery bag filled with ingredients so that we could just sort of look at it and make our meal out of it.
Kay Hanley: And just dump it out all on the table.
Tom Polce: Just like, “Okay,” and just try to understand. So it was a lovely sandbox between Kay and I, and Dana and Bill, and then of course Akiva and Henry. We were sort of like, that’s the creative team. It was just a happy, happy place.
Ayla Ruby: Now you guys obviously talk music. Right? You live, breathe music, and the world of music, and they do story and the world of story and characters and stuff. How did you guys, you talked just a little bit about their collaborating, and I’d love if you could dig into translating between music and translating between characters, how you make that all fit? Because it’s a difficult thing and it turned out brilliantly.
Kay Hanley: That’s a really good question, and no one has asked us that before.
Tom Polce: That’s amazing.
Kay Hanley: So I won’t speak for Tom, but for me, I really found the height of my creative powers when I started working as a songwriter in scripts. I love being given a songwriting directive. Like, “Here’s where the song goes. It accomplishes this narratively. It needs to make you feel this way. It’s going to have the…” And if I have that information, I am absolutely fearless. I can become that. Whereas if I’m writing for myself, Tom and I are in a band called Letters to Cleo together, and-
Tom Polce: It’s harder writing for yourself.
Kay Hanley: It’s so much harder writing for yourself because you’re flying without a net. And also, my ego is really attached to these songs because-
Tom Polce: That’s the one right there.
Kay Hanley: Because it’s about me, I am revealing something about myself. Now, the thing with this is that even though I’m writing for a character and the voice of a character, so-
Tom Polce: It’s a cloak.
Kay Hanley: I’m not really revealing anything about myself, but I’m revealing everything about myself because I’m not afraid to do it, because I’m not speaking as myself. And so having a story where you’re helping. We’re really working in the service of someone else’s creative vision. So we’re workers among workers. It’s so much easier doing it this way.
Tom Polce: She can speak for me. That was perfect. That’s a million percent correct.
Ayla Ruby: That’s an amazing sentiment. I love that. And I’m going to have to think about that and sit with that, because that’s cool. So obviously you had these songs written, but you have this cast with varying musical talents, amazing talents. How did you fit the songs with the people? What was that process like?
Kay Hanley: Well, we went one at a time, right?
Tom Polce: Yeah. Well, first, we met with them, right?
Kay Hanley: Oh, right, that’s right. So Tom went to Toronto and met with actors.
Tom Polce: Yes. And so I went out to Toronto while they were filming Season 2. And they put me in a trailer, they gave me a guitar and a piano, if I recall. And then I had a little Bluetooth speaker, and I had a little recording system. So they would just sort of schlep each one in one by one. And I think we allotted up to a half hour with each person as they had a moment to sort of get off of the set.
Kay Hanley: They’re filming.
Tom Polce: Yeah. And as you had mentioned, astutely, we were assessing their skill, their willingness, how excited they were. And we had those varying sort of skill sets. Some were complete ringers, some-
Tom Polce: And then of course, Rebecca, also a ringer.
Kay Hanley: And Rebecca too, right.
Tom Polce: … just crushed it. And seasoned, theater people and musical people. And then we had ringers that didn’t know there were ringers, like Ethan, who plays Spock walked in. And I think the first thing out of his mouth was, “I don’t sing.” And I was like, “Okay.”
Ayla Ruby:And that’s in the episode too, right? I think, or no, someone else says that.
Tom Polce: Well, no, actually Mbenga says, “I do not sing.” He also said that.
Kay Hanley: He does not.
Tom Polce: But then, so Ethan, I was like, “All right, so what do you listen to?” And that’s basically what we did. I would pull up the music that they listened to, and then I would ask them to sing for me, and then we would sing together. And then I would grab a guitar, and I’d find a song that we both knew and we would sing, and I would assess what their range was, just so that when we write songs for them, we’re not blowing it and writing in a key that they can’t write it in. And also trying to be in a world that they already enjoy musically, if that works out.
So we did all of that. I came back, I met with the creative team. I said, “All right, here’s the scoop. Here’s the vibes.” And then quick pause, they came back with just a bullet point list of an overall idea of, “This is what happens here. And this is,” what Kay mentioned ,just like, “This song needs to do this. This is the person singing it. This song needs to do this.” And by and large, it was correct with a couple additions and swoops around. And then it started, I went to Kay’s place.
Kay Hanley: You’re like, “Here’s Christina’s song. Go.”
Tom Polce: Yeah, yeah. And we did them in order. And we did them in order, yeah.
Ayla Ruby: Oh okay, that’s cool.
Kay Hanley: Yeah, we did.
Ayla Ruby: So for both of you, was there any song that was your favorite to work on? Or just love how it turned out that you’re most proud of?
Kay Hanley: Lyrically, I would say that I’m the X. That was such a moment when we cracked that code about how to have a romantic-
Tom Polce: X and Y variables.
Kay Hanley: How to have a romantic song for Spock, the last person in the world, or-
Tom Polce: Breakup song, yeah.
Kay Hanley: … this really emotional breakup song for Spock. Like, “How the fuck? What? How do you do…” So when we cracked that code, searching for Y, I’m the X, having a math equation, a proxy for a breakup song. So that was pretty incredible feeling when we cracked that code. And I mean, obviously not obviously, but Keep us Connected for me was an incredibly emotional ride. And we knew it was going to be Celia. And this is also where having her range on, having that-
Tom Polce: Knowing.
Kay Hanley: … Tom knowing what’s her bottom note, what’s her top note? Because we wanted to go through the whole thing.
Tom Polce: Do all of it
Kay Hanley: We wanted to use every single part of her range, and we did. And God, that song, it just still to this day, kills me.
Tom Polce: Keeping Secrets. I mean-
Kay Hanley: That yeah.
Tom Polce: … that lyric is crazy. That is a beaut. Okay, so that’s one of those songs, unlike Celia’s, where it doesn’t include nomenclature from Star Trek, it doesn’t matter where that song lives, right? That song, and as I mentioned, while all of them have thematically things that anybody can relate to, that one can just be anywhere. That one kills me, that one kills me.
Kay Hanley: That one. And that’s a good example of a song that I would never write for myself, that is-
Tom Polce: A open nerve.
Kay Hanley: I mean it really is, it’s a subject that’s in there, and exploring that idea through her character, it just-
Tom Polce: It’s freedom.
Kay Hanley: Yes.
Tom Polce: Its free.
Kay Hanley: It gives such a fearlessness to tackle this really deep emotional subject matter that lives inside of me. But I would never say it for myself, but I’ll say it for her.
Tom Polce: Yeah, it’s something you would write in your own journal for nobody else to see. You know what I mean? It’s one of those vibes.
Kay Hanley: I don’t even think that I would-
Tom Polce: You would do that, yeah.
Kay Hanley: I don’t even think that I would look there.
Tom Polce: Yeah, yeah.
Kay Hanley: Sometimes it takes a character to see, it’s easier to see it in someone else than it is in yourself. And that was kind of just the ongoing journey of this project.
Tom Polce: La’an’s song too.
Kay Hanley: Yeah, all of it. All of it, yeah. Including Klingons.
Ayla Ruby: I’m going to ask about the Klingons. But I think that’s part of why this is just such a beautiful episode and why the music is so beautiful and catchy. And yeah, again, great job with it all.
Tom Polce: Thanks.
Ayla Ruby: You just mentioned the Klingons, and I have to ask about the Klingons because I would be not doing my duty if I wasn’t. The Klingons at the end in the finale, was that always planned? How did that come about? Because that was great.
Tom Polce: Thanks. Well, you pointed at me, yes?
Kay Hanley: Take it.
Tom Polce: Okay, I’ll take the beginning part. So look, we are at the end of the songwriting process, we’re several songs in. This particular song destroyed us because, one, we are fatigued from all of the writing, exhilarated at the same time. And we were really excited about the quality of the songs. So we’re at the finale, which cannot disappoint after all these songs. And also after all the goodwill, our fellow creatives, Akiva and Henry, and Bill, and Dana, they were psyched on this. Right? Which is another good observation about when you work with a team or, you don’t want to let them down. They’re not interested in a status quo song that’s, ” It’s okay, it ticks the boxes.” We really wanted to make sure that it was killer.
So it killed us, frankly. And by the time we got to the Klingon bit, and I think we took that one on as a separate thing, we were writing, and then we knew the Klingon thing had to happen in the middle of it, because it’s a non-sequitur. It goes in and out. So initially it was like, I mean, “What do we do?” I hopped in and I drove to her place. I took out the guitar. I was like, “So what are we doing? Are we doing opera?” And I think even before I got the word out, she’s like, “No, we’re not doing opera. I’ve got an idea.” And then?
Kay Hanley: And then, so to kind of leapfrog off of what Tom was saying, I forgot about this. It was going so well that we were just feeling ourselves. We were just like, yeah, we’ve got this irrational confidence.
Tom Polce: Bravado, yeah.
Kay Hanley: So I was like, “Here is what I think our Klingons are.” And I had pulled up my favorite video by my favorite K-pop band, boy band. And I turned it towards Tom, and I hit space bar. And he was like, “Oh my God, yes.” And I was like, “Right?” And he was like, “Yes.” He’s like, “But you’re pitching this, because I’m not.” So we did. We pitched it to them, and they were like, “Oh, hell yes.”
Tom Polce: Immediate, “Yes.”
Kay Hanley: Immediately. They were like, “Absolutely, 100%.” And then a few days later, as they-
Tom Polce: When the Peanut Gallery chimes in –
Kay Hanley: No, as soon as the Suits chime in and the other people, and there’s a committee behind the committee.
Ayla Ruby: Notes and notes.
Tom Polce: Yeah. It’s like when your parents tell you to major in accounting and theater arts, it’s like, “Something in the back pocket as a just in case. This might be a little too crazy.” And we wrote it and shot it. We shot two-
Kay Hanley: Yeah. The opera version does exist.
Tom Polce: Oh yeah. It’s on the DVD. If you buy the DVD in Blu-ray, Season 2, it’s part of the package of the sort of special whatever.
Kay Hanley: Is that out? I haven’t seen-
Tom Polce: It’s totally out. Yeah, it’s totally out. It’s on the YouTube too. You can find it there as well.
Kay Hanley: It’s on the YouTube?
Tom Polce: Yeah.
Ayla Ruby: I’m going to have to look for that. Because I didn’t know that version was out, and I want to see that now. Cool. I know we’re just about at time, but is there anything else you want people to know about you guys, or the episode or just anything you’re working on?
Tom Polce: What do we want to tell them?
Kay Hanley: I don’t know. I mean, I could talk about this forever, but I think you did a really good job covering all-
Tom Polce: You got all the things.
Kay Hanley: You got all the things. And you got a lot of information out of us quickly, because usually, we’re very long-winded.
Tom Polce: Yeah, we are.
Ayla Ruby: Okay cool. Well, thank you again. This is great.
Tom Polce: Thank you for having us.
Kay Hanley: Thank you so much. This was great.
Ayla Ruby: Cool. Have a great day.
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