Steven Prusakowski
Slow Horses follows a dysfunctional team of British intelligence agents who have been relegated to MI5’s Slough House, headed by Jackson Lamb (Gary Oldman), the dumping ground for agents who have had their share of missteps and failures.
One of the most notable inhabitants of the department is River Cartwright (played with wit and tenacity by Jack Lowden) whose monumental failures follow him everywhere he goes. Yet, the disgraced agent, whole grandfather (Jonathan Pryce), continues to find to perseverance to try to shake the reputation he has
Lowden spoke with Awards Radar about what goes into playing River including the humor he injects – even to the most serious of moments, working with the incredible Gary Oldman (who Joey interviewed about the show here), the loss of his onscreen foil and much more.
Here are some excerpts from the full video conversation which you can watch below.
And what was your original draw to the series? Were you a fan of spy dramas, MI-5, things like that?
Everybody always is, and particularly in the UK, that sort of tradition of the dark alleyway and sort of trench coat kind of trope is always really seductive. But the main thing was the scripts.
I’d never read the books. The scripts came, and it was their humor, really, that was just the biggest draw. I mean, it was so bizarre and so wonderful to think of what is essentially like a work-based thriller where everybody’s a little bit bad at what they do was just sort of really delicious.
Was the humor something that came natural to you?
Yeah, when I do anything I’m trying to find what would be the funny way of doing something or what would be the way of undercutting a scene. As far back as I can remember, even going to the cinema and watching a serious film, I would be constantly making quips to whoever I was with, like whether it was my mum and dad or then girlfriends or friends or whatever, in the most furious moment, I would try and find something funny to say. So it was a kind of match made in heaven, so to speak, that when you’re sort of trying to save someone’s life or trying to stop the world from being blown up… I think it’s a real opportunity missed if you don’t make a joke.
I’m the kind of guy that, if I go to a funeral, I really want someone to just stand up and go, ‘He’s not dead!’ I just want that to happen because I’m a firm believer in humor being the best medicine. Because if you don’t laugh, you will just cry.
River is kind of a punching bag and a punchline. Yet, he keeps fighting. Where other people, it would seem like you go, that’s it, I’m done. I had this horrible failure. And everybody knows about it. Everybody talks about it consistently to his face and behind his back. But what keeps him fighting? Where does that fight originate?
I think it’s partly arrogance and self-belief that he just doesn’t, this is a momentary blip, but it’s a momentary blip that’s now gone on for five seasons. So I think it’s still that he, someone’s going to go, ‘Oh, that was a mistake. What are you doing there? Get back.’
But I think the other half is sort of now coming out of spite to Jackson Lamb, to Gary’s character, is that you can ride him as hard as you want, but I won’t fail. I thought about this the other day, is that I wouldn’t, I’m not completely adverse to the idea that River doesn’t go home and cry or stands in the shower in the morning and has a good cry.
We don’t see that, of course, but I think it’s quite important to think that that could be a possibility and that it’s something that he just turns on when he gets to work. Maybe we should have that. Maybe we should have a scene where he’s just crying. See, I find that funny.
Yeah, the old funny shower crying scene.
Yeah, that classic. (laughs) I think we could have that. I think a lot of people, again, more people would associate it with that, a morning cry.
And in addition, you have this relationship between Lamb and River, which is very unique and extremely bumpy. I was wondering, does he see Lamb as kind of a, even if he doesn’t know it, does he see him as kind of a dysfunctional surrogate father? How do you see the relationship between those two?
I don’t feel that River has ever felt he needs a father. I don’t think he’s felt he ever needs anybody. I think he admires his grandfather because he wants to emanate him, basically. But I don’t feel that he needs anybody because his mother dropped him very young as well. So he’s been on his own.
I think with Lamb, I think it is firmly in that sort of employee and boss thing. I don’t think he sees him as a father at all. But I think that if ever anything would break me and make me cry, it would be to see Lamb put his arm around River and really get a brief moment.
But the wonderful thing with Slow Horses is that you take the cynicism, we take it so far where people are so individualistic and only looking out for themselves. They’re all worrying about their career. If there’s a tiny fleeting moment of tenderness between two characters, it thumps you right in the thorax. So I think that’s what’s wonderful about the potential of their relationship.
And what has it been like working with Gary… the relationship on and off screen?
It’s brilliant. He did this wonderful thing very early on where we did a small rehearsal at the beginning of the first season when everybody was terrified, not really knowing what we were going for or what the tone was. And we did this little bit of rehearsal and then we had a break and we all went for a coffee. And Gary stood, and I still believe he just did this on purpose, but that’s also the mark of the man that that’s how much of a perfectionist he is.
He just stood in the coffee queue and he sort of went, ‘I don’t know if I got that. I don’t know if I’m getting this. I don’t know if that worked.’
And we’re all going, ‘What? Shut up’, in our heads. But it was the best thing he could have done as well because it instantly made all of us sort of calm down because this legend was worrying whether or not he was any good. But that’s the mark of a perfectionist. So it’s wonderful to work with him. It really is. And the fun that he and I can have in particular, just coming up with stupid things to try and make each other laugh.
To be doing that at work with a guy of his caliber is still very ‘pinch me.’ I still can’t quite believe it. It’s gotta be amazing.
So this season we saw the death of Rivers Foyle when Spider dies. Was that a shocker? Did you know that was coming?
It was a shock. I did find that a shock, to be honest with you. And also a shame because I love Freddy Fox and he, anytime he and I got to do scenes, it was just, and it was wonderful. And in this one in particular, there’s a big theme between him and I that was just such a joy to watch. Watch Freddy just let go.
Freddy just went, like he left everything. He left everything on the canvas. He just went mad and it was just wonderful to watch. So I’m still not quite over him not being there. I don’t quite believe that he’s dead. I hope he comes back. You never know. They might do a flashback to when River and him were, River and Spider were sort of coming up through the ranks, chatting at vending machines.
So one of my favorite scenes of the season had River being a good friend to Louisa, and who’s still dealing with Vin’s death. And he tries to help her and she throws back all these insecurities that he has at him. He’s, all the, you know, his, you know, she, she digs deep and digs quick, but he turns around and hugs her. What does that say about River?
I think that scene in particular was wonderful to do, mainly because of Rhodes, because of the act that plays Louisa. She’s so easy to act with and she and I really get along. We have very similar sorts of tastes and feelings about the characters.
And I actually, it was me that suggested that hug at the end, because I kind of felt where he was when, in a sort of panicked position of not really knowing if he’s helping. Thinking he went into it with sort of noble causes, you know, noble intentions. And seemed to make a mess of it.
And, but that’s because she’s sort of twice as smart as him emotionally as well. So it was a sort of panic move to just hug her. And I like, we’ve all sort of, maybe we haven’t, but I’ve been in those situations where you think you’re helping, but you’re really not helping.
And, and that was a very real thing. And we were very keen on that being the theme of the conversation. Was it being well-intentioned, but poorly executed, essentially.
She, the character of Louisa, the way that it’s been developing is really, I, I love what she is to River. She’s very, she’s almost like a big sister that he’s never had, you know, didn’t have any siblings. So, I love the way that they’ve taken them.
You can see all of Jack Lowden’s work as River Cartwright in Slow Horses streaming across three seasons exclusively on Apple TV+.
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